Discus with popeye not eating

Question

popeye, possible hole   QUESTION: I was dealing with another allexpert, Renee, basically had stopped eating turned dark in my community tank (6 discus), I put him in his own hospital tank his colors returned, treated him with metro, aquarium salts, melafix, tried multiple different foods over 3 weeks including frozen blood worms, frozen beef heart, discus sinking granules, dried brine shrimp, live black worms, never saw him eat, local fish shop said he must be eating something to stay alive? heater in hospital tank conked out (now has replacement) so I put him in the community tank, first two days seemed ok, swimming around, extending out his fins re-assuming his dominance of the tank as the main discus, suddenly today third day, after water change (well water, 35-40% change every 3 days w/ 1 cap of seachem prime, 1 cap of api water conditioner as always) his eyes appear to be very large, though perfectly clear. don't know what's going on with him, I asked Renee on here she said it looks like popeye and probably caused from my fake plants (even though their silk) that the plastic stems could have hit his eye too hard, though this has never happened before in the 6 month life of this tank, and to treat with 1 tspn of aquarium salt for every gallon, I dosed last night, she's saying if no improvements today dose half of that and wait ten days, and that I could also put in meth blue, which I do have with me. but I'm worried about harming benificial bacteria and worsening the situation. I cannot ask renee because I've maxed up my follow-ups so I'm turning to you hoping you could help. I don't know if I should take out my silk plants as they hide behind them when needed. she also recommended black water treatment which I will try to get soon.

should I dose with 18 teaspons of salt, take out carbon from filter media and dose meth blue as well?

the discus still has his color (not as dark as when he first stopped participating in eating with the other discus over 4 weeks ago) but his eyes are still bulging clear and now he's losing his ability to stay upright since I saw him hiding yesterday.

I have meth blue, pimafix, metronidazole and api aquarium salt.

as a side note.. I noticed on one of my other discus 2 weeks ago slight very tiny hard to notice little pin holes on his face, I always closely inspect my discus, now today on the problematic discus he seems to have some of these tiny little pin holes on his face. Could this be something? Local fish store initially said since none of my fish seem to have the same eating problems as the problematic one.. that it's probably not my tank, and it's internal parasites, that's when he gave me the metro and I treated the discus in the hospital tank. He's now in the community tank and unless he goes back into the hospital tank (maybe last resort don't want to stress him) the treatments will have to be considered for the whole tank.

ammonia less than 1ppm
0 nitrites
low nitrates
ph bit lower than 6
water at 84-85 degrees

water is well water, water changes 35-40% every 3 days 1 cap seachem prime 1 cap API water conditioner.

attached is a photo of him taken today as he lost balance, shows tiny pin holes, eyes remain clear and bulging.


THANKS SO MUCH FOR YOUR HELP, can't thank you enough.

ANSWER: JC,

 Sorry to hear you are having problems. It is hard for me coming in at the end to know all what has been discussed between the 2 of you. As far as the popeye. If only one eye has this then yes it is very possible it was an injury. In this case it usually heals on its own, Since you mentioned his eye(s) meaning both and its been 4 weeks then I would say no it is not from an injury but something going on in the tank.  don't think removing the plants will do anything so i would leave them in. First thing that comes to mind is a sudden change in the PH. When this happens, popeye is one of the first signs. Since he is the only fish with this problem, I would put him in the hospital tank so that he is alone and will not get picked on by the other. To get a good outcome from this problem, it has to be tackled as soon as possible. It looks like you have done that. It is very hard to treat in its later stages and that is where i think your fish is now. I am thinking that the fish is suffering from popeye due to his environment. There is something in the water be it ph or ammonia. I am sorry but I am at a loss here. I do not know how big your tank is so I cannot tell you how much salt to add, but using meth blue might be a good idea now that it looks like you are now dealing with hole in the head. I would do a large water change of about 50% before add the blue. I might even change out the media in the filter. Other than that I really don't know what else to tell you. If you have any more questions let me know and I will try to help you through it.

---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------

QUESTION: thanks jayme, I went to my local fish store today who have lots of discus with my camera with the photos in them... he looked that photo of the eyes of the discus.. he felt that since they were perfectly clear that it isn't pop eye. yes both eyes are inflamed and large but they are clear. also the pin holes he said doesn't necessarily mean hole in the head, he said many discus naturally have these natural pores in the head.

the fish has only had these large eyes for 4 days, he hasn't been eating for 3 weeks. he said penicillin is great for any head healing and it's more powerful than melafix/pimafix, so he sold me some fish penicillin, my hospital is only 10 gallon, main tank is 36, sick fish is in the 10 gallon now with 10 teaspoons of salt, proper 10 gallon dose of penicillin and vita-chem.

I also purchased maracyn, I have metro, pimafix, melafix, meth blue. I guess I'm going to see if I get any results from the penicillin....

do you think I could/should treat with maracyn at the same time as penicillin? how often should I water change right now? my hospital tank is due a water change, when I water change should I put in the penicillin and salt dose back in that I took out? For example 50% water changes on the ten gallon would mean putting back in 5 teaspoons of salt, half a tab of penicillin, 10 drops of vita-chem?

I don't want to put too much stuff in his tank.. but I feel he may on his way out. =(

your best and sound advice is appreciated, thanks for taking the time to answer!

Answer
I am thinking that maybe lay off adding the salt. I am not a true believer in using salt all the time. If you have been using the salt this whole time with no help, then it is safe to say the salt might not help him at this time. I would just use the penn and let it try to help the fish. The less we have to put in their water the better off they will be. Always follow the directions on the medicine bottles. Never add more or less. I am thinking he is pretty bad off and the penn might just do the trick. Do the water change and then add the meds. I do not think it is a good idea to add the maracyn with the penn. might be over doing the meds. See what the penn does in the next 24 hours. If you see no change for the better but a change for the worse then I would try adding the salt and maracyn. His immune system is not working right and we don't want to add any more problems to this poor sick fish.