Sick Platy...help!

Question
QUESTION: Hi, We are homeschoolers who just got a new 10 gal aquarium. We took this very seriously and learned how cycling works and we bought our fish 3 days after we set up our tank, and it was cycled about 28 days after start up.0 ammonia and nitrites! (long haul) We put a sunset and sunset fire wag platy on a Wednesday, (both male according to petco, they went everywhere together never chased or bothered each other) Treasure the sunset platy died on day 3, had white lips thats the only visual thing we noticed, seemed to just lie near rocks. Other platy was fine, but hid and was the scaredy cat, after she died he became more comfortable and became comfortable with us and swam about all day. We added 2 new fish this past Monday. As soon as we added them, Pharoah our old fish, rammed the new one that was a mickey mouse platy, and left the twinbar one alone. All day he chased and rammed or checked this mickey mouse one everywhere. He was the smallest. The next day, Pharoah chased the twinbar, but not ramming it, just swimming everywhere it went, seemed to annoy the twinbar.
Now, both the Mickey Mouse Platy and Pharoah, our old fish, ram each other and both pick on the twinbar, and it rarely rams anyone. But it doesnt hide from these bully fish, they just constantly swim together, sometimes they seem fine and almost like they are playing? do fish play?
and then one will just kinda peck at or ram the other all of a sudden. Then I will notice Pharoah chasing the twinbar again. Last night I noticed that the twinbar has one pectoral fin missing. Not sure if this happened before we got it or recently? did the bullies do this? is it going to grow back? should i move the twinbar?
Also, I am not entirely sure that the twinbar is a male or female. I have seen the pics but it is just so light and sometimes it looks like it could be one or the other, maybe it is just so young? I dont know... Seems like Pharoah trained the newer mickey to be his protege!
The whole time this sweet twinbar minded its own business,
so can you tell me what is going on with these guys, do they hate each other, is this going to end? are they just establishing a pecking order? Is this how they act when they are friendly?
In the future what is the best way to make sure they fish are not fighting with each other. The kids worry so much about each others fish. Is there a difference in like agressive fish fighting and ramming each other? or kinda peck hitting them? I gave each of the fish a time out at some point, seemed to cool them off for a bit. I rearranged the aquarium to help throw them off, but hasnt done much to conrol thier ramming and pecking. This goes on about 50% of the time, the rest is swimming, and what seems like playing or something. If I had a new fish at some point, (can I add one more platy in a 10 gal tank or not? I have 4 kids, each wants 1 fish to name) what can I do to ease the process of being friendly? should he be larger? would that help or do you let him hang out in bag longer? Is there a book on platy behaviors I want to learn more they are fascinating fish, and I love to observe them.


ANSWER: Hi Laura,
How cool is that? I was homeschooled too!

You have observed some very common behavior associated with platies and many other livebearers as well. Platies, like all livebearers, have a strong instinct to breed constantly. And if you have 1 or more males and any females present, the males will  constantly chase them as part of their courtship ritual and attempt to breed. Distinquishing between males and females is not too difficult. Their bottom fins are the reliable indicator.

This is a female's fin-
http://fish.orbust.net/images/female.jpg

And see the male's fin difference?
http://fish.orbust.net/images/male2.jpg

If you do in fact have a female. You may be expecting babies sooner or later.

But if it turns out you have all males. Their chasing and ramming is all part of their pecking order and dominance behavior. The little fish with the injured fin will heal with good care. Otherwise as long as no fish is being made miserable (having to constantly hide in the corner), I wouldn't worry too much as they are just behaving normally.

I don't know if any books specifically about platy behavior but there is a recent book on livebearers which you can look at here-
http://www.amazon.com/Aquarium-Livebearers-Animal-Planet-Library/dp/0793837014

I hope helps and happy fishkeeping!
Karen~

---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------

QUESTION: Hi Karen! Me again, I could not find the answer to my question anywhere, so I thought of you, the only person who seems to be able to answer my questions!
So we still have the 3 fish, they are all males as I thought. The twinbar platy all of a sudden turned pinkish like a week ago and it looked like she was bruised a bit and her top fin deepened to an orange that was not visible before, as she is opaque like. She behaved normally but looked like she was in a fight. I read up and believed that she had Septicemia. I went to the store, got Maracyn 2 as directed from all websites I saw, plus guy at pet store, so I added as directed for 5 days treatment. The fish got better right away, the redness cleared up a bit every day and by 5th day it looked normal again. Now about 3 days later she developed a dry skin look to her. Now it has been about 10 days now since we first noticed all this, and she looks like she has flaky skin, when she swims around it looks like it is shaking off a teeny pieces of skin or scales. She is still behaving normally eating like the pigs they are. Is this some kind of reaction to the antibiotics? Is she still sick? Is she getting better?  Should she be isolated? How long can a fish be in a plastic fish bowl as a hospital tank without bubbles/air? (like an hour? a day?) by the way.
What do you think is its problem, others look fine.

Speaking of the others, Spongebob spends most of his day hiding in the corner under a tree, only comes up to eat.
I feel terrible about this guy... he deserves a little fun! Pharoah the ruler of this tank, chases him when he gets anywhere near (usually accidentally) the other fish, the twinbar (Jewel) it is as if Pharoah is a lovesick puppy, he follows him around move for move, turn by turn, almost mirror like 90% of the day, every day. What the heck is wrong with Pharoah, I could see if this was a female, but it is obviously not, Jewel seems to be irritated but does not hide from him and has gotten used to at times his shadow. He is very protective of Jewel, why this behavior in males? What do I do about Spongebob?
Should I get a divider for Pharoah for half the tank?
Should I get another male closer in size to be Spongebobs pal? Nothing has changed in like a month for poor spongebob, I have rearranged the tank several times, bought additional plants for them to hide, 10 gallon tank with 8 or 9 plants and a rock to hide in. Why to do about these crazy kids?

Also is septicemia something humans can catch while cleaning out the tank? Also, while I have you, should we change the water 25% every week? or every 2 weeks now that we are all past cycling?

THANKS SO SO SO SO MUCH for all your time and help.
My kids are getting worried and I am getting kinda frustrated with the lack of info out there about what I am encountering.
Happy Holidays!
Laura


Answer
Hi Laura! Nice to hear from you and your fish adventures again!

I'll try my best to help. The flaky skin is familiar to me and I've seen it in fish that has either a mild fungal/bacterial infection or they are shedding excess slime due to skin irritations/water quality. I don't like advising meds left and right because they can often do more harm than good if you treat when its not necessary to be treated.

What I would recommend for her is to change the water like crazy. Which just translates into changing about 50-75% everyday with pretreated water of a equal temp or just a bit warmer. Often the best 'medication' for fish who are "off-color" so-to-speak is clean water as it promotes healing so well. Another thing that would be a good idea is some aquarium salt added to her water. Platies tolerate salt well and it can help deter parasites,fungus and infections from setting in. But if she has a truly stubborn case of say fungus, salt may not be enough. We won't worry about that for now.

I'm worried about her getting enough oxygen in the bowl. I'm honestly not sure how long a little fish like a platy could go living in a normal fishbowl of say an estimated half a gallon or water. Somehow goldfish survive living in bowls (not for too long through).

It's up to you, but if this were my fish I'd probably move the twin-bar into the main aquarium again and just keep a good water change regimen of about 30-50% everyday until you are sure the twin-bar is better. This is a lot of work but it is necessary to insure your twin-bar fully heals. You can still add some aquarium salt too just as a precaution, (predissolve in a cup of warm conditioned water and pour it in a little bit at a time at intervals)

Sounds like Spongebob is the true "black sheep" of the group. He may be the lowest ranking male and therefore easily bullied into staying out of the others way. And if you are certain the Twin-bar is a female, that tendency for dominance is even more magnified. Males just have a natural tendency to be quite aggressive and often you do best with just 1 male per tank with several females, males constantly fight for females even if there are many. I don't think another male would be a good idea for spongebob and it would probably make matters worse. You may have to just keep one male per tank. Or separate with a divider. Some people try taking out the aggressive fish for several days and then re-introducing it again but sometimes this doesn't always work.

There are very few diseases you can get from your fish. Septicemia is definitely not one of them. ;-) no worries.

As far as cleaning your tank, for now with the twin-bar in mind, daily to every other day water changes would be great until that one is better. From then on, I like once or twice a week water changes of about 30-50%. The larger the percentage/frequency the better for your fish of course.

I hope this helps and best of luck!
Happy holidays to you too!
Karen~