Strange noises in the stomach

Question
QUESTION: Hello. I have a twelve-and-a-half-year-old Jack Russell cross, who is in good overall health, bar a little arthritis. He was fed dry complete food and took a Glucosamine supplement for his joints for about three years, which seemed to periodically make him sick (once every few weeks). His vet at the time said it was likely to be this that caused it. Several months ago, I changed his food to a higher quality dry one (Orijen Adult) that contains high levels of glucosamine, so I gradually phased out the supplement. He loved the new food and seemed to do well on it apart from a little bit of an upset stomach the first few days he was getting used to it (with hindsight, I should have done it more gradually).

Now, he is still sick once every few weeks, and the raw carrots he used to have and any kind of bones (specifically intended for dogs) seem to make him sick as well. Every so often, he gets loud gurgling noises in his stomach and won't eat any type of dog food, despite the fact he seems hungry. This is often accompanied by diarrhoea, though not every time. (If it goes on long enough for me to worry, I sometimes give him plain chicken, which he will eat.) Sometimes this lasts a day, sometimes a few days. Previously the vet told us only to worry if the vomiting became more frequent and that he might just have some sort of inflammatory gastrointestinal problem. Occasionally, he seems a bit off-colour and sleepy for up to about twenty-four hours, but most of the time, he is very bright and bouncy.

Both my dogs had suspected campylobacter a couple of months ago, but after a couple of weeks on colloidal silver, this seemed to be resolved - and certainly, the other dog is now fine. The only other thing is that since switching to this new food (which they both LOVE, and which is 70% meat, 30% vegetables, 0% grains), both dogs seem to become slightly dubious about eating it once it has been open for a few weeks, although the younger dog will eat it if there is nothing else. I thought I would mention this as each time I open a NEW bag, they dive straight in. The manufacturers say the product is good for several months after opening, and I keep it in an airtight container. So I don't know if this is relevant!

I'm quite perplexed, and wonder if I should get the older dog x-rayed or change his diet again.

Thank you.


7 days feeding chart   ANSWER: I can tell you one thing right off the bat- this food has way too much protein for a dog his age. Protein is excreted by the kidneys, and the older a dog gets, the less efficient they are at filtering. Higher protein is a huge work load on the kidneys and this food is making his work very hard.

On top of that you are feeding him something that makes him ill now and then- but he gets it daily now. That doesn't make sense to me to continue doing.

The Minimum amount of protein in this food is 40%- which means this could be as high as 70 or 80% protein. That is more protein than a puppy would eat!

This food has never been trial fed before to dogs- so they do not know the long term affects on this kind of food. Their AAFCO statement proves it:
NUTRITIONAL GUARANTEE
ORIJEN ADULT DOG is formulated to meet nutritional levels established by the AAFCO Dog Food Nutrient Profiles for ALL LIFE STAGES.

Formulated means that they only make it so it meets the standards but it has never been tested and fed. They also do not use a fixed-formulation, which means whatever is cheaper on the docks that day is what will go into the latest batch of food. This is one of the reasons your dog gets diarrhea once in awhile and feels sick. Each time you open a new bag you are also getting a new batch which could have been made from an entirely different source of protein than the batch before. As long as the nutrient count on the bag stays the same (which is not the true readings of the food either) by law they are fine.

We only use and recommend Science Diet because it has a proven track record of over 50 years of feeding trials and veterinary research.
I know a lot of people assume (wrongly) that corn and grains are bad for dogs but dogs are not obligate carnivores like cats are- they lean more toward the omnivore side just as we do.

Dogs are NOT wolves, they have a different way of digesting their food because of being domesticated for so long. They need the same type of food all of the time and they need a food that gives them optimal nutrition that is designed for their age and lifestyle.

Orijen foods are another in a long list of jump-on-the-bandwagon fad foods that prey on people not trained in the finer points of nutrition.

Hill's pet foods, on the other hand, have nothing to hide, so they go out of their way to educate people on proper nutrition and how to feed a dog correctly.Their website is full of information for the pet owner as well as coupons and hundreds of testimonies.

Now for your dog, I would switch him slowly over to the Adult food for Sensitive stomachs or put him on the Longevity senior food. It is specially formulated to meet the needs of older dogs.

This food and all of Hill's products are made with fixed-formulation- which means the ingredients don't change from batch to batch so the food is always consistent and doesn't cause these upsets.

The choice is yours, but if my dog were having these issues with her food I would rethink what I am feeding her.

She has been a Hill's dog all of her life and she is 12 yrs old but runs like the wind still and if she wasn't white around the eyes and muzzle she would be mistaken for a dog of 6-8 yrs old.  She is lean and fast and has never been sick once in 12 yrs.

Go go Hill's site and look around. Try the three bag challenge and see how it effects your dog in three weeks. It takes that long for a food to start to show up on the outside of the dog.

Hill's has a 100% money back guarantee also- something you don't find often in pet foods.

Give it a try and let me know how he does in three weeks. Here is a chart for switching his foods.

three bag challenge:
http://www.feedingisbelieving.com/believe/3-Bag-Challenge-Form.html

See how Science diet has changed these pets:
http://www.feedingisbelieving.com/believe/Transformation-Stories.html

and here is more on nutrition:
http://www.feedingisbelieving.com/believe/Precise-Nutrition.html

When you read about the foods in each category you will notice that Hill's gives you a dry weight analysis of the food. That means that it is the true measure of what the food ingredients is. No water- just optimal nutrition.

Feeding is believing! I don't work for Hills- I don't work for any pet food company- but I have fed it and sold it and recommended it for over 30 years, so I do know that it works.
Please let me know how he does and if this food helps him out. Try the Sensitive Stomach first.


---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------

QUESTION: Many thanks for your comprehensive (and prompt) response. I just wanted to clarify one thing, which is that my older dog has been sick periodically for three and a half years (since he first started a glucosamine supplement), but has only been fed Orijen for the past few months. (He used to be fed Pro Plan on the recommendation of the vet.) The vet just told us it was probably the glucosamine making him vomit. Although he has now stopped the supplement, this is because his current food contains a high level, so I wondered whether it could still be this that is making him sick?

The other thing is that when I looked into which food to get for the dogs, I was concerned that Science Diet contains unspecified "Meat by-products" and "Chicken liver FLAVOUR". Corn of some sort is also listed more than once, and since changing to a food with no grains, both my dogs have completely stopped scratching and biting particularly at their tails and feet. However, taking into consideration everything you have said, do you think it would help to switch him to Orijen's Senior food instead, if he is finding the current diet too rich, or am I looking at starting over with the search for the "perfect" dog food?

Again, thank you very much for taking the time to answer my concerns.

Answer
I understand your concerns Amanda.
First let me assure you that corn does NOT make dogs itch. Wheat does. Wheat is high up there on the allergen list along with beef, pork, and sometimes lamb. Chicken is rarely implicated nor is turkey. Corn is a highly digestible protein source in these foods and most people give it a bad rap because they don't realize that it is the other ingredients that cause the problems, not corn.

Secondly, all dog foods contain meat by products, but only Hills makes their bone free- which most companies do not. They do this assure that the levels of calcium and phosphorus are lower which is important for healthy kidney function.Chicken meal in the Orijen is a good example- chicken meal is a type of by-product even if it isn't listed as one. The difference is that Orijen chicken meal is ground up bones along with the skin etc. Hill's de-bones all of their by-products.

Orijen Senior has just as much protein in it as the one you are feeding. They clearly do not understand the connection between protein and kidney health. That is why I trust Hills.
They pioneered wellness foods over 50 yrs ago and are still in the forefront for diets.

We rarely see a dog come in chewing on their feet that eat this food. Fleas, inhalant allergies, etc are usually the culprits.

Even smoke in the household or from a wood stove can cause this.

Here is the Orijen Senior listing for Protein & Fat:
GUARANTEED ANALYSIS
  
Crude Protein (min.)   40.0%
Crude Fat (min.)   15.0%

Here is Hills Mature Adult Small & Toy Breed:
Protein   19.3
Fat   15.9

Big difference in protein levels!

This link takes you to the page with the nutrients. Note that they are given in dry weight matter- there is no max and min because these are the true amounts.
http://www.hillspet.com/products/science-diet/sd-canine-mature-adult-small-and-t

I wouldn't search all over for the perfect food- you will not find it. You need to trust in experience, research, and the proof of millions of dogs that have benefited from the food being tested and fed over the last 50 yrs. Or you can pay for a lot of fad foods only to realize the only thing that has improved is the weight of your wallet.

As I said, you can't lose with Hill's. If your dogs start to chew or have problems, take the bag bag- empty or not, and get your money back. But wait at least three weeks to make sure it is really in their system.

I hope that helps somewhat. If nothing else, use the Hill's foods as a bench mark against the rest. But you will see that they are not giving you the whole picture of their nutrients and so it will be hard to tell. I know one thing, regardless of the rest of the ingredients in it, I would NEVER feed a food that high in protein as the Orijen is to ANY dog let alone a senior one.

Let me know which food you finally land on.