Starting a new aquarium

Question
QUESTION: I HAVE ASKED ANOTHER PERSON ON THIS WEBSITE THIS QUESTION BUT HIS RESPONSE LIST IS FULL SO I DONT FEEL HE WILL RESPOND QUICKLY----i am hoping to start a aquarium that will be either a 50 gallon or a 75 gallon
(most likely a 50) under the supervision of a relative who used to own many fish
that lived healthy and long but i have a different eye for fish than her and am
wondering if the fish that i like live well together.i have my eye on Gouramis
mostly, like the dwarf, and blue Gouramis, i also like the south American dragon
goby. sadly I'm pretty sure that i wont be able to have the goby because i herad
that while it is marketed as fresh water, that it is actually brackish water (is
this true?). i also like the Ram chiclid which i herd is more peaceful than most
chiclids and can live with Gouramis. the butterfly fish is also nice but i herad
it is aggressive and i would like to stay clear of any fish who would start fights or hurt other
fish. anther thing i herad is that a betta fish can live well with Gouramis
which i am a bit sceptical of. and for the ground of the aquriam i like the dark
black sandy gravle but am wondering if that is bad for any plecos i might want
in the future and if it is harder to clean than the small rocks. if there are
any other fish that u think would add to these fish i would appreciate it, and
the more wired  the better

ANSWER: Hi Raz,

We all have a certain marked limit of questions that we can get to in a day, some take on more than others, you should get a response from anyone that is showing 'available', within 3 days.

If you are starting up a new tank the first thing that you should concern yourself with is cycling the tank.  This is a process that happens to all newly set up tanks and should be done without fish (fish in cycling tanks will die) because it will be faster, cheaper, less work for you and much less frustrating.  You can do this by setting up your new tank just as you would if you were about to add fish: add water, gravel, plants, decos, filter, heater, anything else that you want in there.  Make sure that you use a good conditioner for your tap water, I like Prime the best.  Wrap a piece of raw cocktail shrimps (or two for 50+ gallons) in new pantyhose piece and toss them in the tank to rot.  Get a liquid drop test kit (I like API Master Freshwater Kit the best) and monitor every few days for ammonia, nitrite and nitrates.  You will see the ammonia rise and fall, nitrites rise and fall and finally nitrates rise.  When you have 0 ammonia, 0 nitrites and 5-20 ppm nitrates, then you are cycled!  This should take a couple of weeks.  You can also help it along by using filter media or handfuls of gravel from an established, healthy tank (like your relative's) into your tank.  You can wrap the gravel also in new pantyhose if you don't want to mix it in with your own.  DO NOT rinse it off with tap water and DO NOT let it dry out as this will kill the beneficial bacteria that you are trying to harvest.  

Once you can confirm you are cycled from your testing kit, pluck out the pantyhose and toss them in the garbage, do a 25% water change and you can slowly start to add new fish, 2-3 at a time, starting with the most hardy and least territorial and working your way up to more delicate and more territorial species.  You want to add slowly, just a couple, let the bioload in the tank adjust, wait a week, add 2-3 more.  See how it goes, in a week add a few more.  Do this until stocked fully.  This eliminates bio-overload and will help prevent an ammonia spike.  Any ammonia and nitrites will be deadly to fish.  A healthy, established tank NEVER has these present and always has only 5-20 ppm nitrates.

In a semi-aggressive tank, as it seems you wish to have, it's best to densely plant your tank and have plenty of driftwood, caves, rocks and other hiding places to eliminate aggression between tankmates and be sure to lightly stock your tank so inhabitants have enough room to establish their own territories..

I would skip the goby.  A goby will need a brackish set up, which some of your other tankmates you want won't appreciate or do well in.  Prehistoric dragon gobies do not necessarily require a brackish set up but the problem you'll have with them is that they get to be 2 feet in legnth.  No fear though, there are plenty of freshwater fish to choose from to make an active, colorful, entertaining semi-aggressive tank.  You can get a couple of loaches that look similar to the goby so you will still have the look you want but without the brackish set up.

You also have some very aggressive fish picked out with some less aggressives and this will never work.  You need to make up your mind if you want a semi-aggressive or an aggressive tank.  For example, blue gouramis will never get along in a tank with ram cichlids or even dwarf gouramis, but they will be fine with most loaches.  However, dwarf gouramis and rams will be fine together and they will also work well with most loaches.  A betta can go in a tropical community tank with less passive species of gouramis like dwarfs of honey sunsets but even the dwarfs might not work.  The key again will be light stocking and plenty of plants & caves.  Never put a betta with more aggressive gouramis, like the blue, or with highly aggressive loaches.  You will also have to watch the betta around the rams but they are pretty peaceful so if you have a betta with a good temperment it should be fine.

Butterfly fish are aggressive and will eat smaller, top dwelling tank mates.  I would not keep them with other passive fish.  There is also a high percentage of butterfly fish that need to be quarantined because they come diseased.  They do not like 'new' water and need to be added to a long-established tank.  Personally, I would skip them.

You can go with the small black pebble gravel as opposed to a sandy substrate.  The pebbles will give you the same dark look but will be easier to clean and easier to anchor your plantings into.  As long as you have a large syphon hose for tank maintenance and really get in there with it you will pick up large amounts of the gravel from the tank floor, it swirls around in the syphon and spits it back out into the floor clean and free of debris.  What you want to avoid is a lot of larger rocks and larger pebbles, they are a bear to clean.  I have very large pebbles in my 55 gallon because I have 4 large goldfish who were prone to getting smaller gravel stuck in their mouths I would find myself in tank with tweezers all too often playing operation.  The large gravel is better for them but I have to do twice the maintenance to get it as clean as my other tanks.

You will need at least a 50 gallon tank for semi-aggressives with more being better.  I would strongly recommend canister filtration as it is the best.  

I can recommend two different tank set ups for you and you can choose the one that best suits you.  One is less agressive than the other but both should not be considered passive set ups in the least.  You can tweak it too if you want to.  I'm basing this on a 50 gallon, heavily planted, caved out tank.

Idea #1:

2 Blue Three Spot Gouramis
6 Serpae Tetras
6 Green Tiger Barbs
1 Rainbow Shark
2 Tiger Botia Loaches
2 Angelfish (mated pair is best but they can get aggressive toward tank mates at spawning time)

Idea #2

2 Dwarf Gouramis
2 Kuhli Loaches
1 Crowntail Betta
2 Bolivian Rams (seem to acclimate better than Blue or Gold Germans)
6 Penguin Tetras (or Red Eye Tetras or Congo Tetras)
4 Silver Dollars

Good luck : ) April M.


---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------

QUESTION: thank you very mush for this answer. about the ram chiclids, i probably will start with the buluivian rams for sevral years or so and was wondering if the blue or golden rams will be more likely to be attacked by other fish because they have more color? and thanks for the sugetion about the loaches, they seem nice to have in a tank like the one i want to bad they dont have the firec expression of the dragon goby. u also said something about a Prehistoric dragon gobies but when i tried to serch about it the same info and pictures came up as for when i serchd for the south american dragon goby.and while the neon dwarf is my faverite gurami im wondering what other guramis go well with it because i like the blue paridise and the Pearl Gourami, while i dont think it can go with the pearl or paridise because of size difference. and can the different types of dwarf Gouramis get along, like the Flame Dwarf, or Honey Dwarf. thanks again for your timely answer

Answer
Hi Raz,

Remember that cichlids are still cichlids and while gold, blue and bolivian rams are all considered 'peaceful' that is in the sense of the cichlid world if you get my drift.  I would say that blue rams are the most delicate and hard to keep alive.  They do not like 'new' water or even newly established tanks.  Golds and Bolivians seems to be a little easier.  The rams, especially if you get a pair, will tend to get nasty with tank mates at spawning time, but they rarely nip.  They usually just chase the invader until the invader retreats and the ram goes back to their territory.

If you are leaning more towards set up #2 or a variation of #2 there is really nothing that I can see that would all out attack the rams, and especially not because of color.  Silver dollars are pretty timid and will keep to their school and so will tetras and barbs as long as they are in a shoal.  The betta will leave the rams alone.  It's not color that provokes them but finnage and they don't have the flowing fins that would cause a betta to go bonkers.

Here is some more info on the prehistoric dragon goby I was talking about:

http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/prod_display.cfm?c=830+836+2526&pcatid=2526

And for the gouramis, again, no dwarfs with anything other than other dwarf gouramis.  The larger gouramis will attack dwarfs.  I wouldn't put the paradise with a dwarf either.  DO NOT put a paradise fish with a betta.

I have kept neon blue dwarfs (x2) with dwarf honey sunsets (x2) just fine.  It was funny because the honey sunsets were in the tank first and they avoided each other.  One stayed in the front of the tank, the other always in the back.  When I added the neon blues the honeys became fast friends.  They never bothered each other but they estblished their own territories and stayed away from each other.  However, again, the key to any of these set ups will be a lightly stocked tank with dense plantings and hiding spots.

Good luck : ) April M.