My two Persian queens didnt give birth and the babies died

Question
QUESTION: I have Persian (doll-faced/semi-punch-faced) cats, and two of them were expecting (both have had very healthy babies before). I wasn't sure about the date of their pregnancy, so I didn't know how late they were. I took my queens to the vet today, and as it turns out, one's babies are dead inside, and the others might be salvaged if the queen gives birth by tonight (he gave both of them an injection to induce labour, though if they don't go into labour I'd have to get them operated tomorrow).
I simply do NOT know what went wrong. They're on a very healthy diet (all fresh meat, with a little dry food left out at night for munching) lots of water and some canned food; I've given them this diet for a long time and they've always been healthy and have given birth to healthy kittens.
For the life of me I cannot understand what went wrong. The vet said that it happens, but how can it happen to BOTH the queens at the same time? There has to be SOME explanation. Can you help me in finding out the reason, by either telling me what you know on the topic or by telling me how to go about investigating?

ANSWER: Dear Urooj

I am sorry that this has happened but I don't really have any answers for you but wonder if there is something in your environment that has caused this - perhaps a chemical you have used or if you are near fields has the farmer sprayed something that could have been blown towards your property.  Could they perhaps have had a fight with each other or other cats in the house and then taken an awkward fall?

I wonder if it is worth having them swabbed to Strep G, a bacteria that can live in the vagina to see if there is any evidence of  it so that can be treated, or ruled out.  If it is found then they will need antibiotics

It is always wise to make sure that you witness the matings so that you can be more sure of the expected date.  It is then easier to take action before it is too late.

I think this time you will have to put this down to experience and mate them again in a month or so's time.  

Regards

Marcia.

---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------

QUESTION: So, they had to be taken to the vet today, and one had sepsis in her uterus, and the vet is recommending that I spay them as well. Which, alas, I will have to do because the alternative is painful c-sections each time they mate. I'm so sad.

I don't have any new chemicals introduced in the house, nor do I live near the fields. How can both of them have this problem? My third queen, as it turns out, is also pregnant, and now I'm concerned about her as well, what if I mix up her dates as well? Any ideas about whether an oxytocin shot is recommended, or if I should wait? Because the kittens are still moving about and healthy, and I don't want to traumatise them or my queen unnecessarily.

ANSWER: So sorry to hear the news about the two girls but their health must come first.  Do make sure that there is absolutely no other alternative to clear up the sepsis first before making the final decision to spay.

Re your third girl, ask the vet if it is worth covering her with antibiotics which would be suitable to deal with things like Strep G to be absolutely sure you have covered all the angles.  That the kittens are still moving is good and I think I would watch her carefully.  Is there any sign of milk yet, even slight.  Have a really good think about the dates.  When did you first see her teats change colour, when did you first see the kittens move - that is normally about 7 weeks.  Watch carefully for any change in her milk glands and watch to see if she is nesting, both signs of an imminent birth.  Don't go wading in with oxytocin as if it is used too soon it is dangerous to the queen - the birth canal must have opened first.

I can only assume that there has been some infection present with the other two girls.  Was it the same stud?  May be he is carrying something - Strep G can be carried by males too.  There are a lot of things to explore to see if the problem can be avoided for the future.

Good luck with your third girl.

Regards

Marcia

---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------

QUESTION: REAL bad news, the third queen's babies have also died :( I am so distressed and sad. Yes, you are right, it was the same Tom who serviced that. He lived with my niece, and I'm completely unsure about how hygienic his living conditions were, because even though my her house is clean, she can be pretty irresponsible about her animals.
But the puzzling bit is that my friend's queen, who is still at my house, also mated with the same Tom (it was her first birth) and she has given birth to healthy kittens.
You think I should get the Tom checked? What should I do to ensure that this does not happen to other cats. My poor queens would have to be spayed most probably, because the vet said that the only alternative would be painful c-section births each time, and I love them too much to make them go through that.
I'm sorry if I am acting really needy, but I do need some answers, and some idea as to what to do, my vet is being completely "this happens all the time" about it, but I really don't want this to recur, even if it's someone else's queens.

Answer
Yes I think it would be a good idea if the Tom is checked to make sure there is nothing happening with him.  You friend's queen may have been strong enough to fight any infection that may be present.

Re your queens, some vets don't necessarily agree with breeding and seem to think that once a c.section has happened that the cat will always need one.  This is not necessarily true, though of course I don't know exactly what the problem is with your girls and I am not a vet.  I have had queens need a c.section and have gone on to have kittens normally on the next litter.  You are the only one that can ultimately make that decision and it really comes down to how much you trust your vet to give you the correct information.  I would question his comment about it happening all the time - this sort of thing of 3 queens at the same time having the same problems is very unusual and there has to be a common denominator, in this case I would suspect the stud.

If it was me, I would want swabs taken of the infection and then take advice on whether to spay.  For now if they were my cats I would get the c.section done but not spay and get some answers first.  You can spay later if the results do indeed mean that the girls should not be bred again.

So sorry this has happened to you.  It is always hard to accept that after waiting 9 weeks you have no kittens.

Regards

Marcia