Agressive Rat

Question
QUESTION: I've read your answers for aggressive rats, I have a female rat who is over the top aggressive, she was a biter when I got her (I didn't know at the time she was pregnant either, so not sure if it's due to lack of socialization or just inbred aggression) I got her from a Rat Rescue in Reading PA. She's a biter, but now that the kittens are here, it's twice as bad, she lunges, spits, and hisses if I even go near the aquarium that I use as a nursery. The Kittens are 8 days old, the litter was 15, but I've actually taken four out, and given them to another rat who seems to be doing well with them. My question is, do you think she will keep being this aggressive after the kittens are weaned and re-homed? Also, since I am not actually sure of her age, would it just be kinder to have her put down? I hate thinking this way, but I have to wear gloves to even change the water, and feed her, and cleaning the bedding, is a nightmarish chore that requires my family to vacate the home in the off chance she would get loose!
I've been thinking of taking the kittens and giving them to my rat Martini who's litter is just about weaned, in the hopes of quelling the aggression with proper socialization, I will not be able to properly socialize them if they stay with the mother.

Any advice/help will be greatly appreciated,
Lynn

ANSWER: If you just got her the past few weeks, I can almost promise she was a biter because she was pregnant.  It is normal for pregnant rats to bite and even more for new mothers to bite, especially since they dont have a clue what your intentions are.

I am confused, I think (nothing new with me LOL) but am going to assume  you just now adopted her recently and she came to you full of babies in her belly.

I would not put her to sleep. I would work with her. I have tamed biters many times including a very nasty wild rat who ended up being the best rat I ever owned. People used to accuse me of switching rats, she went from being as mean as what you describe your girl as being to super friendly and fun to be around.  

I would not put her down. I feel sorry for her. She has a good chance of changing especially since she is new to your home. She doesnt trust you and she can feel your fear and also probably can tell you may not be real fond of her, either. Rats feed off of our energy and if it is negative, they are negative towards you.  I am not sure how your first attempts at handing her were, but if you tried to reach in for her without her ever have had been properly socialized, she is going to bite to protect herself from you because she has no idea what your intentions are and also needs to protect her babies.  Please do NOT remove any more of her babies from her.  No wonder she is hissing and going after you.  Your now taking her beloved babies from her. This is why she was mean from the start, to protect her babies, and now she is even worse, to keep them safe, and your doing exactly what she is trying to prevent: taking her babies. She doesnt know what your doing to them. She has no clue you are taking care of them. All she knows is that your a threat.  You  need to put yourself in her place and view it from her point of view.   
Please do not remove her pups from her. Once the babies begin to move around some you can reach in and take them out to get them used to humans.   You do need to work with her though.  I know your a rat lover or you would not have other rats and you would not have looked at a rescue for one.  Also, in order to keep her from getting loose, you can surround her cage with a cardboard wall so that if she does get out she will find herself inside the enclosed area and cant go anywhere.   

Anyhow, you asked if it would be kinder to put her down and I say no, not if your willing to work with her with trust training and have your mind made up that she is missing out on a happy loving home at no fault of her own. Be determined to understand her way of thinking and learn the right approach with her.  I think she has a good chance of learning to trust you esp once her babies are older and she doesnt feel she has to protect them as much.  She will focus on her own safety and it is up to you to make her feel she is safe, loved and wanted.   Please see my page on how to trust train a biting rat.  I dont know about you, but when I rescue, I tend to go for the underdog. I go for the shy rats or the biters because I know that nobody else wants them and I apply my knowledge on rat behavior to understand their way of thinking. Most of it is fear that is causing their aggression.  A biting rat bites out of fear and they bite to warn you.  If she were out of her cage, she would hide rather than attack you but in her cage, this is all she knows and it is her territory which she has to protect.  Also, you dont know her age so you have no idea what type of home she has lived in. She may have been neglected.  Its obvious nobody tried to work with her, but again, most pregnant rats that are unfamiliar with their surroundings and having a new owner etc....plus being pregnant, she has had alot to deal with and she is one little rat in a grat big world full of more people that cringe at the idea of her rather than consider her for a pet.  I feel all rats deserve a forever home and its up to the owner to try to provide it to the best of their ability.  Even if she continues to bite, which something tells me she will change for the better, you can always love her from a distance. I have done that with lab rats that came to me as adults and hated me until they started to get old and sickly.  I never gave up.  I hope you dont either.

Here is my website and the page on trust training.  Hopefully this helps some.  Keep me posted

http://www.freewebs.com/crittercity/trainingshyorbitingrats.htm

Good luck, too!!



---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------

QUESTION: I do love her, she's a beautiful rat, nice points, pretty curly hair, cute little pink eyes...when I first got her, she was in an iso cage, where I kept an eye on her, and watched for signs of any illness, which I do with any rat that I adopt. She wasn't fond of being handled, but I could offer her treats, and she would sit with me outside of her cage, as long as you didn't try to pick her up. Once I realized she was pregnant, I kept her in iso, but did introduce her to a few of my other rats, so that she would have a few to socialize with, she however had other plans, she is extremely rat aggressive...she will go after my other established rats, even in the neutral play area.
She is also people aggressive, and has been, she's never hesitated to go after anything moving outside of her cage, that includes my three cats, and dog. I moved her to an aquarium so that my 16 month old daughter would not get bitten. Once the kittens were born, all bets were off, anything, and I do mean anything moving outside of the tank became a target for her rage, she will charge the sides, and hit her head on the side of the tank until she bleeds. I've been bitten by rats before, newish who are afraid, I don't enjoy it, but I don't fear it either. Where you are wrong however, is that even once she is out of the cage, she can, and will attack, she will not go to hide. I've owned, showed, and bred rats for nearly 20 years, and never have encountered a rat as aggressive as she is. I go to the tank, and we chat, well, I talk to her, I tell her what a good momma she is, how pretty she is, in a calm, voice, she is a pet, a loved member of our family, however, I cannot put my other rats or pets at risk. We've never picked her up by the tail, I've tried several methods to calm her aggression. Treats, putting her into a bonding pouch, just letting her hang out in my bra under my shirt. If you would touch her through the shirt, she would strike out at you, I gave her a T-shirt that I walked in for a day, so she would get used to my smell.
Nothing seemed to help, only made her more aggressive. Perhaps I should have mentioned, that the kittens I took from her nest, were being injured, by her, I would only open the tank to feed, water, and switch out small bits of bedding. When I found a kitten in the food dish, with a back leg, and tail chewed off. I did check the others, and there was one other missing a leg, so I did remove them.

To answer your questions, no, I would rather let her live a life alone, and talking to her, and maybe winning her over little by little, until I can at least sit with her, her in her own space, me in mine, to at least the point where she doesn't injure herself at the mere sight of a human. I currently have 17 adult rats, 12 Females, 5 Males, and two litters of 14, and 15, with a third litter on the way (The Himmie Girl, and a Fawn Hooded who I adopted pregnant) While I feel bad for her, if she's left to raise a litter of kittens, they will also be aggressive, I've seen it happen with rats left pregnant in a shelter setting with no socialization.
And while I think you're right, she does deserve to live out her life in one home, I don't want her to continue to hurt herself either. I will talk to my vet to see if perhaps spaying her after her remaining 10 kittens are weaned, but if she is going to continue to mutilate the kittens, yes, I will take them, I'm not a rat, but the kittens appear healthy with the exception of the missing limbs!
I've put the tank in a quiet corner of the dining room, where she can still hear the normal every day sounds of family life, I covered half of the tank with a towel to help her feel more secure. But I cannot, and will not allow her to injure herself day in and day out. I'm afraid frankly that she will charge the side of the tank and break her own neck!
I perhaps didn't stress quite how aggressive she's become, and it's not my fear of her, rats bite, it happens, it hurts, you move on, I don't want her fear of people, to end up killing her when she breaks her own neck charging at a curtain blowing in the breeze that is within her view, and she perceives it as a threat to her own safety, and ends up killing herself.
I do wear the gloves now, because she attacked my hand so severely, I required stitches!

Answer

I had no idea she was actually throwing herself into the glass of the tank. I also know how important it is to socialize the pups or they will be very timid but not socializing a rat doesnt always make them aggressive just super skittish.   Its a good idea that you have her the tank also.  I still think she will ease up once her hormones start to go back to normal again.  However, spaying doesnt help aggression in females like neutering does for males.

There are various medications rats can take for aggression with females, some being hormones.  Lupron for starters, has helped with aggression and even low dose valium can calm aggression (after she is done nursing of course)  one thing with valium is due to the fast metabolic rate, valium in low doses do not make the rat all sedate and drowsy like you would assume. They do very good on it. I have used it for seizures and for anxiety in rats as well as aggression and it does make a world of difference in many cases.  Just a thought.

I am confident though, that you have enough experience under your belt with rats and hopefully once the pups are weaned and her hormones start to get back to normal, she may be where she was when you first got her but hopefully she wont be half as bad as she is now.

I would take the pups out a few at a time wearing gloves when you do it so you can get them used to human touch and hopefully once she sees your intentions are good she may calm down too.