Death of a cagemate/depression

Question
QUESTION: I will try to make this as short as possible, I tend to pay too much attention to detail. First let me begin by saying THANK YOU for your time and services, it is VERY hard to find an actual person who can answer questions about our wonderful pets!

The begin, my husband and I had two ferts. One, Oliver, was turning one in December and we have had him since he was a kit. He has recently passed on. The other fert in question is our five month old Bella. Who seems to be taking the death of her "brother" poorly. Oliver, passed away two days ago, from Kidney failure. The vet assured us it was NOT viral or bacterial or anything we did or didn't do. That it was hereditary and there was no reason for his illness. We had been dealing with his illness for about two weeks until the last visit, when they found out his kidneys had begun to fail. The two weeks up to that point he was extremely sick, off his food, had diarrhea (ranging from bloody, mucus, to green) and vomiting. He was on several medications and continued to get worse, it was a very difficult time. We did allot of online research and thought he possibly had ECE, but Bella was showing NO signs of distress in anyway, and we have had them both with no outside fert contact for 5 months(since we get Bella) Toward the end, she began to act as though she understood he was very sick and began to sleep with him on the floor of the cage (he was too sick to climb to the 4th floor where he normally slept.) Again, the vet assured us there was no way he could get her sick, but also mentioned after we had to put him down she may handle his death poorly.

Since his passing, she has been acting differently. Not to the point I would say was was defiantly depressed, but different. She is not eating normally, so I am trying to entice her with lots of snacks, which she normally takes, but still not much food. I've cut her water with pedilite to again entice her, but shes still not drinking enough. We are letting her out of the cage whenever possible. We are very lucky, my husband and I have crazy work schedules that allow us to spend more time at home then most. I would say she has been out of the cage approx. 10 hours a day, were smothering her with attention and have bought several new toys for her. When she is out of the cage, she acts normally, but when we put her in the cage, she acts as though she is looking for Oliver, then immediately curls up in his old blanket and sleeps. I understand ferts normally sleep allot, maybe I am just being overconcerned, but I feel she is not acting normally. Also, her poop is now turning a green color as well? It is still normal texture (Olivers was not) and she is not acting sick in any way. The vet has been contacted and again assured us there is no way he got her sick. She thinks Bella my just be stressed and that is causing the color change.

The question is, should we concider adopting a new friend for her or see if she can make it through. Even though the vet had assured us she is not sick, the thought of getting another Fert is scary, for more then one reason. Its just a painful thought for us in general, and what if she is sick? or the new fert is sick? I've read that its a bad idea to take a middle age fert and get a kit, but she is only 5 months and still very active. However, we would prefer to adopt then get a new baby. We do know someone who has a son with two ferts that does not want them anymore. They get no attention or love. However tempting to "save" them, it seems like a bad idea to me to get two ferts with developed relationships (they are both one and a half) and add them to a young fert who may be dealing with minor depression issues? I'm at a loss for what to do? Should we see if she can make it through, and if we do will she ever be fully happy again alone? Is it a good or a bad idea to try to introduce two slightly older ferts that already have a relationship?

I hope I've given a general idea, sorry if I've jumped around, allot has happened in the past two weeks.  :( Thanks for your time and help!

Sincerely,
Brianne and Brandon

ANSWER:
*****BRIANNE:  PLEASE SEE NOTE AT BOTTOM FOR ADDITIONAL IMPORTANT INFORMATION*****
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Hi Brianne & Brandon (and one depressed little one):

Your little girl is so very young that she absolutely should have no problem bonding with another ferret - and two are 'the more the merrier'.   If it were me, I would ask these folks if you can bring your little girl over to meet their son's ferrets (or bring them to your house since your home is already ferretproofed) and, if they get along, it would solve everyone's problems all at one time.

The best solution for a ferret who is grieving is some ferret company, roughhousing and ferret play.  Remember when she meets the other ferrets that ferrets play really hard, especially if they haven't played for a while.  Don't worry about whether they are getting along or not unless you see blood flying - just assume they are playing rough. They will cry out and this is part of the bonding process.

The ONLY time you should step in and separate them:  when one of them poops (true fear)......then step in and 'rescue' the ferret that pooped.  Then, put it back down on the floor again a few feet away from the other ferrets - and IF it returns to the other ferrets, it is absolutely fine and just playing. If ANY ferret consistently cries, poops, and runs FROM the other ferrets when you put it back down, that ferret is truly scared and needs to be separated from the other ferrets and try again at another time (ferrets can have bad days when they just don't want to be bothered by other ferrets, just as we do).

Your friends ferrets will possibly be very rowdy when you first introduce Bella to them since they haven't been out of their cage much. They may not initially even use the litterbox because they are SO happy to be out of the cage.  However, they WILL settle down after they get out for a while and I think you will be pleasantly surprised that Bella will be doubly happy with TWO siblings instead of just one. The ferrets who were kept caged will be SO grateful to you for rescuing them that they will absolutely worship the ground you walk on - if you haven't rescued before, you will be surprised, but they *know* when they get rescued and they are soo appreciative, even more than dogs and cats (which are all I had experience with when I first got ferrets).  Three ferrets are A LOT OF FUN....and I hope you will give Bella these precious new playmates; and the two caged ferrets a chance at a wonderful new life with you.  You will be surprised how quickly they will be 'your babies'.

No doubt when you first put them together, both Bella AND the other two ferrets will probably have 'nervous poops' (green and very soft) for a few days. This is completely normal for a ferret going thru any kind of life change. In the end, all three ferrets will be MUCH better off and you will definitely be paid by the entertainment of three happy, wrestling ferrets!

I would, however, *try* to cage them together IF they appear to get along and/or are willing to sleep together. Letting them share a plate of dribbled Ferretone drops is another great bonding experience; OR some warm soup made from Hill's A/D and water and microwaved until it's nice and warm.  MY SECRET TACTIC: Sometimes the best way to 'bond' a group of ferrets is to slip one in next to each other while they sleep :-)  At the very worst, put their cages next to each other, trade the bedding from one cage into the other so their smells blend, and allow them to play together....then, let THEM choose where they will sleep when it's time to go to bed; together or separately.  Eventually, they will all end up in a pile wherever they are :-)  After a week together (and sometimes the very first time they are introduced), they will be inseparable and Bella will be miraculously cured....really.

One note - and it may or may not be relevant.  There are some recent studies that Dr Kawasaki, ferret expert, has published that indicate that feeding ferrets raisins *may* contribute to the liklihood of them developing kidney failure in middle to old age.  Just thought I'd mention it *in case* you feed raisins - they are not only unhealthy because they can cause intestinal blockages, but there is a chemical in them that is very very hard on the kidneys.  I give my kids Ferretone mixed 1/2 and 1/2 with virgin olive oil (so they don't get too much vitamin A). They can have about a tablespoon a week when it's diluted with olive oil and that goes a long way when you just give a few drops at a time. Just a healthy 'snack' suggestion you might want to try.

I'd say that's a definite and resounding "YES"!!  What a good mommy you are to even consider doing this for Bella! And, THANK YOU! You just made my holiday season happy by rescuing those little cage-bound ferrets!  I will be anxiously awaiting news of how their introduction went and hearing that Bella is 'cured'!

Sincerely,

Jacquie Rodgers
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Comment:   I just wanted to say THANK YOU so much for your answer and attetion to my question. We will definatly let you know how the intros. go, we have officially decided to go ahead with the two new ferts thanks to your advice and were very excited! Were sceduling our first get together for this weekend!! Id really like to thank you for mentioning the "nervous" green poop thing, my vet assured me she was okay, but you worded it differently, and were comforted being reassured that this is normal in a time of stress. Also, on a much worse note. I realised that there is a very good possiblilty that I had something to do with Ollys illness...I really hope that is not the truth, but approx. a week before he became ill I gave him some rasins! I havent heard of the studies and I was eating some on the couch while he was out. He of course had to see what I had, and was very interested im having some for himself, I figured it was fruit and okay so he had about 5 or so rasins, a one time thing, but then he got sick. Do you have any websites that I can look up the reserch on this rasin study? I will never forgive myself if I findout I hurt our baby...:( But either way we will let you know how the meetings go, and thank you again so much for your help and advice! Brianne
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Hi again Brianne:

I will try to address the questions you had in your 'comments' with the hopes that it will help your ferrets in the future...and maybe even others somewhere whose owners read this or you pass the information along to.  I have some hesitation because you said "I will never forgive myself...."    Brianne, just know that ALL OF US have learned some things the hard way with our ferrets. Sometimes the only reason our ferrets didn't die when we 'learned' was *luck*!   That's one reason I take the time to do what I do here - some of these lessons I learned the hard way too. I'm sure my ferrets health paid for some of the mistakes I made in early ferret ownership. For that reason, I pass along the following information to you.  You have the ability to save other ferrets by NOT keeping this information to yourself.....and please, DO forgive yourself?  I know for a fact that Olly would have. You obviously loved him very very much.

Here is a website I found where they are discussing "why" Dr. Kawasaki has not published a formal paper on his findings; very understandable I think.  

http://listserv.cuny.edu/Scripts/wa.exe?A2=ind0603&L=FERRET-SEARCH&P=R18694&I=-3

Just promise me that you WILL forgive yourself.  When you knew better, you did better - and that's all that really matters.

<<<hugs>>>
Jacquie Rodgers
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---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------

QUESTION: *Bella Update*

Sorry its taken me so long to reply, I've been taking some time to myself. Still very upset about our Oliver. However, I wanted to let you know, that I have informed our vet, about the rasin incident. She had never heard of this in ferrets, she had in dogs, but not ferrets. So she will be doing some research on the subject and will hopefully be able to save some little furkids in the future!

Like I said we sill miss our Olly so much. But Bella was obviously our biggest concern after his death. Unfortunately for us (fortunately for them!) the two furkids we planned on adopting had already found a home, but they are happy and doing well so thats good news! However, through some of your answers to other people I found links to local ferret shelters and met up with a local woman who does rescues herself and we adopted a new little boy named Oreo. He's one and a half, a little older then Bella, but VERY playful and sweet. They get along wonderfully! He had a few special needs (hes deaf) and very underweight, but were confident with lots of love and yummy soup, he'll be just as chunky as our Bella, who is eating normally again now that he is here.

I just wanted to say thank you for all your help and advice. And thank you for urging us to invite a new furry into our lives! Were very happy with our new addition, he is fitting in very well. Obviously, there is no replacing Oliver, but there is defiantly room in our hearts, especially for a little furkid who needs so much love!!

Thank you again so much for your advice and support. Hopefully we will learn from this situation and be able to help others as well. We hope you have Happy Holidays!!

Brianne and Brandon
(Bella and Oreo)    :)

Answer
Hi Brianne, Brandon, Bella & Oreo:

Wow, I'm SO happy to hear that Bella is once again eating and playing and happy with her new brother. How sweet that you went to the extra trouble to find a shelter and adopted a 'special needs' fuzzy no less! That's SO AWESOME!! I *know* that Oliver is smiling down on his family and is so very proud of you..with love AND FORGIVENESS.  You are definitely NOT the first person to have the raisin problem....I wonder how many died before anyone even suspected them?  They still sell posters that have a picture of a ferret and a can of raisins on it. It's just not well-known how dangerous they are, so I hope you will keep that in mind always. As I said before, we have ALL made mistakes with our ferrets in one way or another; as I learn more. there are always things I wish I had done differently as I look back on my early ferret-owning experiences. Truly, you are not alone, so please don't punish yourself.  Instead, celebrate the fact that you have little Oreo...a very special mommy for a special needs little guy!  You will do great - I know you will.

Here are some great websites about deaf ferrets, just in case you haven't found them yet:  

http://groups.msn.com/Ferret/deafferret.msnw
(wolfysluv site is sometimes down - try later)

http://wolfysluv.jacksnet.com/deaf.html -
http://beta.communities.msn.com/littlenorwayexpansion/deafnessbyterri.msnw


Deafies are SO incredibly sweet! Lucky, lucky you!! :-))  And DEFINITELY lucky, lucky HIM too!!  I'm certainly happy to help you anytime - don't hesitate to come back anytime you need to.

Again, congratulations and HAPPY HOLIDAYS to you and yours!

Jacquie Rodgers