rats with respiratory problems

Question
Hi,
    I currently have two rats having issues right now.  I first noticed a little wheezing and sneezing with my hairless male a little over a week ago.  This weekend, my young female mother of two-week old babies started sneezing, and within 24 hours she had a rattling in her lungs that you could hear across the room.

Initially, the wheezing in the hairless male was infrequent, and I only heard it when I was holding him or when he seemed real excited to see me.  And there was the occasional sneeze.  I gave him some more fleece bedding, eliminated any drafts that could get in his cage, and concentrated on giving him lots of fresh fruits and veggies to help his immune system.  This has been going on for a little over a week.

Last night (10pm on Sunday - no vet available) , when my young mother had rattling lungs, I panicked and scoured my medicine cabinet and found some doxycycline that had been prescribed to me for an infection a few months ago.  I made a suspension using the Rat Fan Club guidelines, weighed her, and gave her the appropriate dosage.  I teach chemistry at the high school and college level, and feel confident that my technique was correct.  It was AMAZING....within a couple hours she was a new rat.   She went from sneezing several times a minute, lethargy, and lung rattling, to the occasional sneeze (twice in 10 minutes) and running around her cage like her old self.   I am taking that as a good sign that the medicine is working.  I will continue to dose her with that, and if it doesn't clarify itself, take her to a vet.   Today, still the occasional sneeze, but no wheezing or lung rattling.  

My hairless male is still sneezing and wheezing.  My husband said that last night after I went to bed, his wheezing got real bad.  He seems quite lethargic, and isn't eating like usual.  The sneezing and wheezing comes and goes.  Sometimes he seems in good spirits.  I also gave him some of the same medicine last night when I dosed my young mother, and he seemed to be quite peppy after awhile, but the wheezing was strong again in the middle of the night.  I am wondering if I need to worry about a secondary infection??  I have some powdered Augmentin on hand (It was from my son, and hasn't been reconstituted yet with water). With my chemistry electronic balance and a little math, could probably whip up the right dosage to supplement along with the doxy.  

Financially, taking him to the vet right now is going to be a last resort for me.  If I can control it with the meds I have, I would really like to try that first.  Please do not take this as being disrespectful toward my vet OR my pet.   A few weeks ago, I took my little pregnant rattie to the vet for what I thought were mites, and they charged me 60 bucks for a visit and a little dab of ivermectin, of which I found out LATER that I could get at a farm supply store.   I have raised so many animals, and tend to try doing as much of my own vet care as possible, saving the vet visits for emergencies.   

Would you suggest that I add the augmentin in addition to the doxy?   Would it hurt anything for me to do that?    Thanks for your time and expert advise.

Answer
Hi


I do understand the fact you prefer the vet as a last resort, and trust me, regardless of my position, I still prefer to do the same. Vet bills add up fast and most vets do not take payments unless you are an established patient. However, they do not disclose the fact they will take post dated checks if they do not bill out, and sometimes they are willing to work with people but you need to ask the vet directly and not the staff members. Just a few little secrets. :)

Anyhow, doxycycline is not the drug to use in a lactating doe. It is not good for the young rat pups at their young age.Being doxy is from the tetracycline family it is not recommended to be used on pregnant and lactating does because tetracyclines  bond to calcium in newly forming bones. This, in turn can hinder their growth and development. It can also cause impaired renal function in young rats. There are exceptions, however, such as when the benefits outweigh the risks. Usually when it comes to medicating young mothers, zithromax is the drug of choice.

As for augmentin, its difficult to say if it will help or not, depending on the organism. My guess is your hairless guy has mycoplasmosis which is very common in rats as you may already know. Being the organism has no cell wall, few drugs work well on killing this particular bacteria, which is why the most widely used drugs used are baytril for rats over 3 months of age, or zithromax and if there is resistant bacteria, a second antibiotic is used, which is usually when doxycycline is added to the dosing schedule.  However, if your rat has a seondary infection I do like the penicillins most,and often use amoxil for my rats. Unfortunately I have no dosing info on augmentin since we never use it and use amoxil instead.

One thing about using the ivermectin paste from the farm supply store:
This has been a circulating home remedy to fight ectoparasites for a long time and most of the time the mites return. Mainly because it is impossible to know how much your rat is really getting if your talking about using the horse worming paste that contains amounts of ivermectin.  The dose calls for using a dab the size of a piece of rice. We are talking using a tube that is a measured dose for a HORSE and yet people are brave enough to dispense this to their tiny rat. I know it can be pricey to see the vet but a better option is to buy revolution from the vet and you can buy the vials individually. Revolution is selemectin, a cousin of ivermectin and .10mls work wonders on a 1.5 pound rat. I have other doses available depending on the rats weight.  I would really steer clear of the horse worming paste if that is what you meant in your post above.

Anyhow I hate to tell you NOT to use the doxycycline. Chances are the pups will be just fine, but you have to understand that I have been taught not to dispense it to pregnant or nursing does so I have to warn you about the possible side effects. The key word is "possible"

If you want to try the augmentin, I would try it with the doxycycline and if you do not see changes in 3 days, that is when I would call the vet for sure. Mycoplasmosis is something that can impair rats for life if not treated properly. Usually the normal protocol is treating them for a full 30 days to prevent relapse. With each relapse comes a stronger attack and often there is damage done to their delicate lung tissue such as scarring or even blistering. Long term problems are lung disease / COPD.  If you want more on myco check out my website here:

http://www.freewebs.com/crittercity/mycoplasmosispage.htm

Just to let you know, I do appreciate the fact that not everyone can just pick up and race off to the vets just because the rat has bad gas.  My disclaimer is mainly for people that buy rats knowing they cannot afford treatment, or parents that allow their children to have pet rats yet dont want to hear the word VET when the rat falls ill. I have had people write to me where the rat was hypoxic, gasping, wheezing, cyanotic, lungs filling up with fluids, rat not able to stand up without falling over and they want to know if they can give it advil to make it better or if they can feed it fish antibiotics. When a rat becomes this sick it is only the humane thing to do is provide proper treatment medically or have it euthanized to ease its suffering rather than watch the animals suffocate. It can be upsetting to know there are alot of rats out there like that too.  So...I put that disclaimer up just so people know that I cannot help a critically ill rat other than suggest a vet and if a vet is in no way an option, there is nothing I can do for them.   Also, I do warn  people about vets that see exotics yet are not exotic vets and often do not have the proper medications, implements for examining them or even proper surgical instruments scaled to size for the small mammal. Exotic vets are no more expensive than a general vet and the better news is that its not a waste of money in most cases because your getting better treatment rather than having a rat remain ill for a month or longer till the vet finally gets it right.
THere are horror stories too, like the girl who wrote because her rat had head tilt and was walking in circles. This is classic inner ear infection and is treated by baytril and steroids to rid inflammation from the 8th cranial nerve that is responsible for the head tilt and walking in circles due to the rat being dizzy. A vet that was not really up to par in rat care told the woman her rat had a brain tumor, namely a pituitary tumor and to put it to sleep. She wrote me asking how common this was and was devastated because she was about to bury her precious rat. It was raining out lucky for her and they could not bury the rat so I told her to put her in the refrigerator and in the morning contact an exotic vet and have a necropsy done. I had a sick feeling this rat died for nothing. Usually with a pituitary tumor the rat loses the use of their front paws (which is a huge major symptom) among other symptoms, but this vet did not give steroids and when the rat did not respond to the baytril after a week he was convinced it was a tumor. If he would have used steroids the inflammation would have started to ease and the head tilt and spinning would ease up. The lady took her rat in and much to both of our horror, the rat indeed had simply otitis media and there was no pituitary tumor. This rat could have been treated if the right vet was seen and shame on the vet for thinking he could provide proper care for an animal he knew only the basics about. I always tell people to check their vets credentials carefully or there could be a fatal mistake like this was.

I know I went way off topic here but I think you probably would find some of this a bit interesting. Its unreal what goes on in the rat world of medicine, thats for sure!
Please keep me posted on how this goes. I am thinking maybe you can dose your rat the augmentin the same way you would amoxil. This is a guess, though, so dont take it from me, just wondered what you thought since this is more your cup of tea than mine!