Veggies in diet

Question
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Followup To
Question - Hi, Dana! Thank you so much for your advice! I have already started the Baytril, and should probably finish the treatment, but I will definitely request a culture and sensitivity test if the Baytril does not clear up the problem. I was wondering what you thought about the cranberry tablets? Ben seems to really like them. I have been giving him 1/2 tablet every night--they have 200 mg of Cranberry AF extract..90% guaranteed cranberry solids, and 60 mg of Vitamin C, (which I guess is 100% RDA for a human). The dose is 1 tab 4x daily for adults, and 1 tab 2x daily for children. If this is ok to keep giving him, how much would you recommend giving him per day? He weighs about 6 pounds. It's a little easier than syringing the juice, and he likes the taste of them. They do have a few other ingredients in them--I listed them in my other email below. Again, your advice is priceless--sometimes I wish I lived in Florida, and you could be my vet! Thanks again so much for your help! ~Heather, and Ben~
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Hi, Dana! I wanted to ask your opinion on something. I have a bunny that is being treated with Baytril for some bacteria in his urine. He did have moderate sludge 2 weeks ago, and I cut down on his pellets, and increased his greens. He always has unlimited hay, and he was being treated with Sulfamethoxazole Trimeth Susp. 2x a day. I took a urine sample to the vet today, and after treating him with the Sulfamethoxazole for 2 weeks, adding greens to his diet, and cutting his (Oxbow) Timothy pellets back to a little less than 1/8 cup per day--she said his urine sample looked better, but there was still some bacteria. He is a 3 year old neutered male 6.25 pound Dutch. Anyway, the vet still suspects a bladder infection, and wants me to treat him with Baytril for 2 weeks. I was reading that Dandelion greens are very high in calcium, and should not be given to bunnies who have had "sludge" problems. Is this true? My problem is that he is selective about what kinds of greens he likes, and he seems to be loving the dandelion greens. He eats the dandelion greens, parsley, endive, red cabbage, broccoli, and an organic mix of baby lettuces pretty well--but he especially enjoys the dandelion greens. I know that a side effect of Baytril can be loss of appetite--obviously I want him to keep eating greens during treatment. What do you think? Should I not give them to him? I also bought some PURE cranberry tablets from the health food store...they have 200mg of cranberry AF extract with guaranteed 90% cranberry solids; and 60mg Viamin C, (which is 100% RDA). Do you think these might help? The other ingredients are: Molasses, Honey, Xylitol, Sorbitol, Natural Flavors, Stearic Acid, Silica, Guar Gum, Magnesium Stearate, and Magnesium Oxide. The dose is one tablet 2x daily for children, 4x daily for adults. If you think this might help, how much would you recommend giving him per day? I also bought some cranberry juice with no added sugar, but it still has 27 grams. What about some of that in his water bottle if he won't eat the tabs? I would apprecaite any help you can give me--I want to get rid of this bacteria so he doesn't need any more meds after the next urine check! I love my bun! Thanks so much, Dana.....what would I do without you? ~Heather~
Answer -
Hi, Heather,

Although sulfa antibiotics are generally a good first "guess" for a urinary tract infection, there's still no substitute for a culture and sensitivity test, to be sure you're using the most effective antibiotic for the particular infection your bunny has:

www.bio.miami.edu/hare/culture.html

Please ask the vet about having that done, so you don't throw money away and waste time trying different antibiotics that might not work very well.  

Cranberry juice has been shown to contain compounds that help prevent bacteria from attaching to the bladder wall in humans.  No one knows if it will work in rabbits, but it can't hurt to try.  I wouldn't worry too much about the sugar in unsweetened cranberry juice if you give only a little (maybe 3cc per day).  Just give it via syringe, as you would with any medication.  He might just like it!  :)  Don't put it in his water, though.  It will just promote bacterial growth.

There's argument about whether or not diet has any effect on bladder sludge.  In the experience of many rabbit rescuers and rabbit vets, reducing calcium intake has absolutely NO effect on sludge, once a bunny is producing it.  It's a metabolic disease, not a dietary problem.  Some experts (notably Frances Harcourt Brown, DVM) are of the opinion that reducing dietary calcium can actually do more harm than good, since a bunny with metabolic bone disease already has trouble maintaining calcium in the bones.  Reducing the dietary calcium could make osteoporosis (common in sludge bunnies) proceed more rapidly.  In short, if this were my bunny, I would not worry about the amount of calcium in dandelion greens.  You can try to take them away, but I will bet you see NO difference in the amount of sludge.

(Note that "sludge" is different from normal calcium salts residue.  Sludge is thick and yellowish.  Normal calcium residue is white and powdery.  If that's all he has, not to worry.)

Please look over the culture and sensitivity article, and let me know if you have any other questions.  Hope bunny feels better soon!

Dana


Answer
Hi, Heather and Ben!  

Well, sometimes I  wish I were a vet.  But I'm just that other kind of doctor.  ;)

Anyhoo...
Because no one really knows what the effective dose of cranberry extract is for preventing bladder problems in humans (or other species), your guess is as good as mine re:  the cranberry extrac pills.  You could probably give him a whole one without harming him in any way.  Can't hurt, might help.  

Not very helpful, is it?  Ah, well.  I just hope he feels better soon.  

Take care,

Dana